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  • Peter Broekhuizen
    Posts: 6
    Joined: May 5th, 2008, 03:27
    Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi there, As a professional arranger, I have to be able in an instrument score to randomly change the number of bars of a particular line, just to make the layout look good. To do that, I use the layout tool. Nothing new, I did so for the last 15 years or so using Logic, without any problem. Recently I upgraded to Logic Studio 8 and an Intel MacPro and I have the following problem: after 4 or 5 times changing the number of bars in a instrument score by 'grabbing' a bar with the layout tool and pulling it down (or up for that matter) -the official way to do this-, I see a mess. 15 bars or more jammed together in one line. No way to work around this. Being able to manipulate the layout af a score is a very basic thing for me. Is this a known problem and does anyone have a solution? It would help me in a major way! Thanx, Peter
    Reply
  • Christian L
    Posts: 1410
    Joined: Aug 7th, 2006, 11:50
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi Peter, Its working out well for me but I don't use the Score window so much these days. If you close the window and come back, does it still looks like mess ? Did you try restarting Logic and reloading your project ? If you want, you could upload your project via sendspace so I can take a look. [url]http://www.sendspace.com[/url] Christian
    Reply
  • Peter Broekhuizen
    Posts: 6
    Joined: May 5th, 2008, 03:27
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi Christian, Thank you for your reaction. Closing down and reopening the program and or the project makes no difference, sadly enough. I talked to several fellow musicians/arrangers of mine in the Netherlands and they experience the same trouble! I discovered the following. I just created tracks in a fully new empty project, then went to the score of any track. I found out that after 6 times changing the number of bars on a line, stuff starts to mess up. So from the 7th time on: problems in layout land. I tried this also in Logics own templates, like the guitar tones or the instruments template. Just open the template and create (long enough) tracks with no notes with the arrow tool and fool around in the score window of any track with the layout tool: after 6 times changing the number of bars of any line, things starts to be uncontrolable and look like a mess. Bars are jammed together. Whether you put in notes in a track or not doesn't change anything. Trying 'orchestral' in the compose templates, it took 10 times to get a mess. Weird stuff is going on! I tried it with the Jazzfont I prefer to use (you can make that choice in the Logic preferences toplevel score) and without: the results are the same. Strangely enough I can't select a project to send to you via sendspace.com. All my xxx.logic files and maps stay grey when I want to select them to send to you. Maybe that has to do with the way I store my files, I haven't got a clue. Logic Studio 8 is new to me. After watching the free Logic 8 A First Look turorial I bought the Logic 8 101 tutoral to learn more! Maybe you can also play around in the templates like I described. Please let me know when everything goes well (also after maybe 30 times changing the number of bars), or that you experience the same stuff we do back here in Holland. I have the latest Mac OSX version 10.5.2. installed on my machine. Thanx, Peter
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi Peter, to send a .logic file or your whole project folder control click on it and select "create archive" or "compress". Try sending the resulting .zip file via sendspace. Cheers Rounik
    Reply
  • Christian L
    Posts: 1410
    Joined: Aug 7th, 2006, 11:50
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi, I tried changing the number of bars on a line about 20 times with absolutely no problem. I also heard that there is a few problems with the Score window in Logic 8. Rounik, could you please try this on your system ? I'm on a G5, maybe it's Intel related ? Christian
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi, I've just tested it out (I very rarely use the score editor)... On a short score (16 bars), I have no issue changing the number of bars on a line. Have done this about 10 times. If you can send the project file, we will gladly take a look at it for you. Best Rounik
    Reply
  • Christian L
    Posts: 1410
    Joined: Aug 7th, 2006, 11:50
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Thanks Rounik! Peter, send us your project and we will take a look at it. Christian
    Reply
  • Peter Broekhuizen
    Posts: 6
    Joined: May 5th, 2008, 03:27
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Thank you for your concern and willingness to help! I really appreciate this. I don't even have to send you a project, because stuff already goes wrong with me using the Logic templates. Today I had a long talk with the guys of the Logic Studio helpdesk, which for Europe is situated in Ireland. They support 90 days after the purchase of any Apple Pro app. They copied exactly what I did. Create a software instrument track in a new empty project. Then create a region on this track with the arrow tool and stretch this region to let's say 60 bars by dragging the rightside. Then go to the Score window (cmd 3) and make sure that you're in page mode. You see a page with the 60 bars with rests in them, because there are no notes. Now use the layout tool and change the number of bars randomly. The first 6 times are ok for me and from the 7th time I use the layout tool the layout becomes an uncontrolable mess. The funny thing is, that they had two machine at the helpdesk in Ireland: one had the same problem I have, the other didn't. The one who didn't, had only a copy of Logic Studio 8 installed and the one who had the same problem I have, had also other Logic software installed Logic 7 and Express etc. I also had 7 installed, so the conclusion was that maybe there was a software clash, specially because I installed 7 after I had installed 8 and later on had to reinstall 8. So I did a full clean format of my system disk and reinstalled OSX10.5 and only Logic Studio 8 from scratch. Sadly enough, I still have the same problem. The strange thing is, that the score window you can make pop up at the bottom of the arrange window works fine: in this window I can use the layout tool any number of times I want without a single problem, but as soon as I switch to the separate score window, trouble starts. For me I have to be able to use the separate score window (cmd3), because I work with full orchestra scores and need the whole display. It took me a lot of words to explain the situation, sorry about that. Like I said earlier, I'm not the only one with this problem. It looks like there is a limitation of the number of times I can use the layout tool. Very frustrating, because the past years everything went smoothly. I need this tool to work for me because of the kind of work I do with Logic, that's a simple fact. Time to sleep now (it's 4 in the morning)... Peter
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi Peter, Thank you for your post and I'm sorry this problem is still an issue for you. Out of interest are you using Logic 8.0.1? Have you installed all the pro app updates too? I wonder if this issue to related to the mac pro as on my intel iMac (which also runs Logic 7) I can't replicate your issue. Will try it out on a MBP next week. Hope there is a solution to this issue. Take care, Rounik
    Reply
  • Peter Broekhuizen
    Posts: 6
    Joined: May 5th, 2008, 03:27
    Re: Scoring: layout trouble
    Hi Rounik, Yes I'm using the latest version of Logic Studio: 8.0.1 and Mac OSX 10.5.2 with all the updates available. I now understand a little more about the problem. By accident I discovered the following. In the score window (cmd 3) the problem is related to the pagebreak. The 6 times I could use the layout tool without a mess were just a coincidence. By default you see in the first page the way I described a total of six lines with 2 staves. I changed the staff style in a single staff style like 'treble' and I could use the layout tool as much I wanted on page one, but as soon I got to page 2, the problem occurred immediately. So the page break is giving the trouble when you work in the score window. I tried to use the page break symbol (I never used it before), but this gets overruled by the layout tool. The score window you can pop-up in the bottom part of the arrange window doesn't have this problem strangly enough, but as I told you: this is no alternative for me. I really hope there is a solution! Thanx a lot, Peter
    Reply
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