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  • logicluvva
    Posts: 158
    Joined: Jun 17th, 2008, 04:11
    De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    The De-esser in Logic is a little unsubtle. I just find the spectrum of thought a little daunting behind this subject.. At one end , talk of meticulously automating the volume....then the plug-ins...then there is the ' pencil and rubber band around the mic ' method.Which is kind of funny ! This seems Monty Python. Why such vastly different schools of thought ? How do I go about volume-automating the esses ? Some run through would be brilliant. All that technology and all we need is a pencil and a rubber band ? Huh ? Thanks to Rounik in advance !
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  • steveH
    Posts: 857
    Joined: Oct 17th, 2006, 05:19
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Yeah the De-Esser is unsubtle...try using the Compressor's extended parameters. It gives you a great deal more control. Be sure to select the same track that you're de-essing as the side chain!
    Reply
  • logicluvva
    Posts: 158
    Joined: Jun 17th, 2008, 04:11
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Cheers , Steve. I tried it out and it works great.That compressor plus the eq are powerful. The de-esser is actually wonderful cutting the loud fret-squeak of the acoustic guitar.
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    [quote:64172]The de-esser is actually wonderful cutting the loud fret-squeak of the acoustic guitar.[/quote] I haven't tried the de-esser on the fret sounds of an acoustic guitar... thanks for the suggestion ! Rounik
    Reply
  • Cajypiu
    Posts: 400
    Joined: Oct 11th, 2006, 09:48
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Hi Pala, there are always many ways to do things and I don't think there is any one right way. The pencil and rubber band trick is a technique used to break up the air flow from the mouth on to the capsule of the mic. This can, sometimes, help tame problem frequencies.... also, angling the mic in relation to the singer/ vocalist or changing the mic (i.e. having a different frequency response) can also help. The EQ'd compressor method Steve suggested works, as does the dedicated de-esser. Some de-essersssss are better than others but also how you use them can make a difference. For example, aiming to tame all sssss with one instance of a de-esser versus using multiple de-essers in series is another way. Both being on milder settings than one plug-in would have to be. Another trick I have heard before is to bus the vocals off to another channel, EQ out the problem frequencies and compress this channel heavily leaving you to sneak modified vocals in under the original vocals. This rebalances the vocals by not turning down the volume of the essess.. but instead bringing the rest of the vocal's volume, up. Hope that makes sense! Cheers, j
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  • logicluvva
    Posts: 158
    Joined: Jun 17th, 2008, 04:11
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Thanks YADJ.That's very informative.I suppose it's about trying to get the source sound as pure as possible, I do find the bussing of the vocal a bit confusing.How do you sneak the modified vocals in ? I'm a musician that's finding myself trying to get technical now.I enjoy it..but sometimes I get a little overwhelmed. I really appreciate yr time.
    Reply
  • Bob C
    Posts: 28
    Joined: Apr 13th, 2009, 07:59
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Hello Steve, This method sounds intriguing...not seen it in a TNT or any of the other tutorials...so far...which one is this covered in? If it is not covered...are you saying to side chain the channel strip...like the bass and drum example in the TNT's? I appreciate the thoughts. Thanks, Bob C
    Reply
  • Cajypiu
    Posts: 400
    Joined: Oct 11th, 2006, 09:48
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Hi Guys, sorry for the tardy response, Ive just moved house! To Pala - yes, I think getting the best sound you can at source is the best foot forward. There are always things you can tweak at a later date but unless you know what you can and can't get away with, you're opening yourself up for a whole lot of trouble! OK, for the whole bussing thing. 1. On track 1 you have recorded some. 2. They are overly sibilant so one way to treat this would be to send the vocals to a bus (bus 1 for example). 3. Adjust the send effect level to Unity (0 on the send level - where the dial will look as though it's pointing to 2 O'Clock). This will send your vocals to Bus 1 and Bus 1 is in turn outputting to the main outputs 1-2. 4. Now, in your mixer, if you select the channel Bus 1, you can insert EQs, compressors, De-essers.... whatever you fancy really but the idea is to remove as much of the sibilant frequencies as possible. 5. Sibilant frequencies such as sss's and shhhh's reside in the 4-7kHz range depending if you are male or female. 6. Solo the bus channel and try heavily EQ'ing in this area. The aim will be not to make the soloed vocals sound good, just minus all of the irritating sibilant sounds. 7. High Pass filtering is also a good idea here too because the aim is to layer the modified vocals with the original vocals and you won't want to double up the bass frequencies because it will change the balance of the vocals. 8. Insert a compressor after the EQ on Bus 1 and heavily squash the vocals to bring up the average level. Look at around 6db of gain reduction to begin with and tweak to taste. 9. Then you can adjust the volume fader on Bus 1 to get a good balance between the vocals being outputted on Track 1 and what is coming from Bus 1. Hope that makes sense!
    Reply
  • Cajypiu
    Posts: 400
    Joined: Oct 11th, 2006, 09:48
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    To Bob C, the side chain method works by inserting a compressor on the vocal channel and getting the compressor to trigger it's gain reduction whenever the sibilant sounds are excessive. One way of doing this is to send the vocals off to a bus, like how I described above, but this time you want to disable the output of the Bus from going in to the main output 1-2 channels. The idea is to have this Bussed channel as the trigger for the compressor, not a vocal layer. Insert an EQ on the Buss and boost the sibilant region. The idea here is to exaggerate the sibilance so that when we cable it to the side chain, the sibilant sounds are over emphasised over everything else, and as a result, they will trigger the compressor and nothing else. Back on your main vocal track, select the EQ'd buss as your side chain input and adjust the compressor settings to suit.
    Reply
  • logicluvva
    Posts: 158
    Joined: Jun 17th, 2008, 04:11
    Re: De-essing methods.Thoughts.
    Thanks for the depth and clarity , YADJ. I think it's great the way you have outlined each method too.Bravo.
    Reply
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