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  • Kejedey
    Posts: 66
    Joined: Jan 15th, 2007, 02:41
    Waveburner - dithering
    Hi, I am currently mastering a track in waveburner. In Logic 9 I have mixed down and bounced in 24 bit with no normalise or dithering, to produce a bounce peaking at -3db, from there I load it in a stereo-mastering project where it is processed, and bounced again, 24 bit no normalise no dither, to produce a bounce peaking at -0.1db. Now I load it into waveburner, where I process it a bit more, mainly with the PSP Xenon limiter to get a loud sounding track. Now when I burn from Waveburner how do I tell whether the track has been dithered correctly? There is a preferences setting for bounces - do I bounce the project first and burn from there? I wish to avoid dithering twice and losing my resolution.
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  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    That's a good question! I normally do my mastering in Logic and export to 16bit and dither there and then use Waveburner only to set out the CD and gaps between tracks... It looks like Waveburner's Burn options will simply discard the bottom 8 bits of info rather than provide dithering options... If an audio sample/file is already dithered, can you re-dither it?... considering that it's already lost the 8-bits of info outside of the 16-bit spec. Rounik
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  • Kejedey
    Posts: 66
    Joined: Jan 15th, 2007, 02:41
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    In Waveburner prefs there is a bounce dialogue, which gives you the chance to select from no dither or three types of POW-R dithering. With POW-R type 1 selected, does this change the bit depth when bouncing the project, bouncing the track - or only when burning to CD? I have been told- and confirmed with my ears - that dithering twice will degrade audio resolution. The wisdom being to make dithering the very last processing that happens to the track. Any ideas about what Waveburner means by bouncing? Does it mean burning? There is no obvious way to bounce a Waveburner track (or mix) in such a way as to change the bit depth - so needing dither.
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Gurner, You're quite correct. Never apply dithering twice. My above reply was quite bizarre really!! I'll put it down to temporary mind blur... Anyway, the Bounce tab options in Waveburner: Waveburner > Preferences [Bounce] applies both in regard to if you bounce your project to an audio file or if you choose the Burn to disc command. Personally, I'd still do all my mastering in Logic, especially if you're not using Waves or Ozone or other Mastering plugins, because in Logic you have access to the additional Dithering algorithm 'UV22HR'. But, either way, it all comes down to your personal work flow preference. :) R
    Reply
  • Kejedey
    Posts: 66
    Joined: Jan 15th, 2007, 02:41
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Rounik, Thanks for that, I'm going to experiment with adding the exciter and Xenon limiter to the chain of processors in my Logic stereo mastering project. I suppose there should be no need for an extra eq or compressor other than the Logic multiband. I'm thinking of getting a PSP Vintage Warmer, do you know that one? Is it good for mastering Dancehall Reggae, to get a bit nearer to analogue tape sound, which we like? Is the other dithering algorythm you mention in Logic good for loud Dancehall Reggae? About Waveburner again, am I right in thinking that waveburner always bounces before it burns, and will not apply dither to a bounced region or bounced project when when burning, so there is no need to untick it in the bounces prefs before burning - (to avoid bouncing twice)? Cheers! Gurner[url]http://jahfayahafroreggae.com/[/url]
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Gurner, PSP Vintage Warmer is nice. Not sure about whether it's specifically useful for Dancehall Reggae... but it's definitely got a decent analog feel to it. Check out iZotope plugins too. I'd recommend trying out all the different dithering algorithms and then monitoring each one to compare and contrast. I think it's the best all-round algorithm... but your ears will be the best judge for what suits your mixed music. Yes, keep dithering checked/ticked. Cheers Rounik
    Reply
  • Kejedey
    Posts: 66
    Joined: Jan 15th, 2007, 02:41
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Rounik, That's cleared a few things up well. At the moment my mastering plugs go: Mutipress LinPhaseE AdLimit MultiMeter These are all tweaked a bit from the basic pop setting, so that has been working for a good clean sound. I was thinking of putting the Vintage Warmer after that, to drive it a bit, maybe a Gain devise after that get unity again, then the Xenon to pump up the volume. Does this sound as though it should work - at least for what it gives, soundwise? I would say the sound I'm after is something like the early 80's 'clean sound' of Roots Radics at Channel One, when they got the 24 track, so it's a bit warm and live sounding, but well clear and nicely recorded - but also a little bit squashed as it will have to be anyway to get it loud enough for radio. Cheers! Gurner
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Gurner, Mastering is an interesting subject... (in my opinion) there's no set one way to achieve a sound. So much of your decisions will be based on the sound you're working with - and what you're aiming to achieve... Have you checked out Steve H's Mastering toolbox in Logic? [url]http://www.macprovideo.com/tutorial/Logic401[/url] It's a really good tut! Hope that helps :) Rounik
    Reply
  • Kejedey
    Posts: 66
    Joined: Jan 15th, 2007, 02:41
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Rounik, I've had a really weird problem for a few days - whenever I burn the track to CD, there is an audible pop/glitch at the end of the CD. I tried putting a fade on in WB, before bouncing the project, but it's still the same. You can only hear the glitch in a CD player, after I imported from CD to Logic, in order to use the file conversion function to get my final wav, no glitch noise!? I have saved a new version of the WB project, bounced project again a couple of times but no change. What could cause that? Cheers! Pete
    Reply
  • Rounik Admin
    Posts: 8713
    Joined: Dec 16th, 2006, 08:13
    Re: Waveburner - dithering
    Hi Pete, Odd... Have you tested this in different CD players? If you play it in iTunes via the CD on your Mac do you hear the pop? Another thing would be to try different CD-R brand... it's a long shot - but sometimes the quality of the CD brand might be an issue... though I would recommend testing it out in different CD players first. Let me know how you get on. Rounik
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